Focusing by Thibault Imbert

I just posted my thoughts on the Flash Player team blog, about the recent announcements we have made regarding Flash Player support on mobile browsers.

As a long time Flash developer who loves Flash, I can tell you that what is happening right now is a good thing.

First, we are making bold moves like stopping the development of the browser plug-in on mobile browsers in favor of investing further in Flash-based apps packaged with AIR. Playing existing content sounds like a great idea on paper, but we know it doesn't always work that way -- you need to author for mobile and think for mobile, but from talking to customers and looking at content today, we realize that very few people are targeting the plug-in on mobile browsers.

Flash developers have always created some of the most stunning, immersive, emotional experiences on the web. They've always pushed the cutting edge, with few restrictions. But mobile is different, and developers need to adapt to different constraints and affordances. Flash lets you do that, whether you are taking advantage of efficient hardware accelerated video playback or native support for features like multitouch and accelerometers. But it's costly to create beautiful experiences optimized for mobile browsers — a cost that doesn't make sense if people using one of the most popular mobile platforms can't see the content you create.

Existing content for desktops didn't always look as magical on phones as people were used to seeing with Flash Player on their desktops. Content optimized for desktops with big screens and beefy processors can’t look as good on a phone or a tablet it was never designed for. This really had an impact on the trust that people had in Flash, and this perception made it hard to start new projects optimized for mobile browsers. There was just no appetite to even try doing this.

In contrast, you guys create super nice Flash-based apps packaged with AIR and delivering them to app stores across iOS, Android, and BlackBerry devices – by the end of this year, you will be able to reach over 350 million tablets and smartphones. Have you seen an article from a journalist saying that MachinariumComb over Charlie, or TweetHunt are horrible ? No, people love those games. Your work fits the trend the entire industry is seeing: even as we're excited about improvements in mobile browsers, the most compelling, immersive experiences for mobile devices are delivered through apps, optimized from the ground up for mobile. We're helping you guys leverage your talent – the same skills in ActionScript and tooling – to reach that huge, growing market of smartphone and tablet users with amazing apps. Flash makes it possible for developers who craft beautiful desktop experiences to deliver great mobile app experiences. We are going to really focus on that, creating the best solution to build stunning interactive content, games, and video apps across all screens.

Flash Player on the desktop continues to show a path for the consistent, super duper experiences that are impossible to deliver to over a billion people with any other technology. For example, Flash Player 11 was released only a month ago, and it now enables fluid, cinematic hardware accelerated 2D and 3D visuals for more people on the web than any other technology. Flash Player uniquely does for the desktop what apps do for phones and tablets: it helps ensure that what you imagine is exactly what your users will see. Flash Player remains the best technology for delivering premium experiences on the desktop, period. Focusing helps us make sure that we continue to drive that continued innovation.

We are not stepping out of the mobile space with Flash, we are just focusing on what makes sense and where Flash looks great, standalone apps with AIR.

In the long term, we're actively working on an ambitious future for Flash. The implementation details may change, as we've been talking about today. We believe that the DNA of Flash doesn't reside in those implementation details, but in our promise to make it easy to create and deliver the most amazing experiences everywhere. We're focusing on fulfilling that promise, and we’re excited to see what the future – and our community – will bring.

Comments (92)

  1. chris wrote::

    Well written Thibault.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 5:09 am #
  2. emrah wrote::

    it can be good thing but i just cant understand dropping iPad and Tablets too. it is not acceptable.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 5:52 am #
  3. Clint wrote::

    What is to become of the IDE – speculation is abound that the entire Authoring Tool team was let go?

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 6:39 am #
  4. tlecoz wrote::

    Hello Thibault, can you explain us why Stage3D is not supported in the mobile-browser. I can understand why you decide to stop flash development on mobile, but if FP11 is still available on mobile, why not with Stage3D ?

    Thanks you in advance!

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 6:54 am #
  5. JB wrote::

    Way to choose center stage, instead of playing second fiddle to someone else’s browser *ahem*. This could pan out to be a good thing for the Flash camp in the long run. Competing with the myriad of app development tools might be challenging, but it’s a battle than can actually be won.

    http://techcrunch.com/2011/11/09/schadenfreadobe/

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 7:25 am #
  6. Nicolas wrote::

    PR wise, that’s a mess :)

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 7:58 am #
  7. Nick wrote::

    Well written indeed! Thank you for posting this. I have been seeing all day sensationalist and heavily biased articles from places like wired that this is signaling the death of flash altogether, which is downright ridiculous. I have been focusing on AIR development for a while now and have seen large improvements to it on a consistent basis. We are building very cool things and attracting new business at an excellent rate, all with a small team which would be impossible with any other technology. Thank you and your team for all the incredible work! :)

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 8:17 am #
  8. Frank Pepermans wrote::

    My thoughts exactly when I read the news the first time, via AIR and as an app, flash makes way more sense on mobile.

    In the end this will hopefully result in a true seamless cross platform solution for all the mobile OS’es out there, which is still a potential killer feature.

    Flash does need to be rebranded however, it’s got a bad name amongst the casual internet users, and that also reflects on potential clients…

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 9:11 am #
  9. loopia wrote::

    Ok, but then you got _a lot_ of work to make air not suck as much as it does today, when doing stuff for android/ios.

    It is not very often it makes sense to do a bloated/slow air-app instead of native small/quick app.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 9:37 am #
  10. Matthew Fabb wrote::

    Thanks for this post Thibault. I think what would really help with many who have their doubts with the future of the Flash Platform would be to write a blog post on the roadmap of Flash & AIR runtimes. Even if it just used info from the Adobe MAX session. Dates can be vague such as Q1 or 2nd half of 2012. I think something like that would go a long way to help people’s perspective of what is happening and to show Flash or AIR is not going to die.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 9:43 am #
  11. Diablo wrote::

    By By Flash …

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:24 am #
  12. Diablo wrote::

    Focusing on AIR …. ? YOU stop focusing on AIR in LINUX

    in time will be others platform when you stop FOCUSING ….

    VERY BAD DECISION !!!!!

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:29 am #
  13. Diablo wrote::

    For us Developers it’s cleary now to take HTML 5

    YOU Made very good work with flash but that was a very bad move ….

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:30 am #
  14. PhilFlash wrote::

    Mauvaise nouvelle, très mauvaise nouvelle, très très mauvaise nouvelle. En plus 750 suppressions d’emploi : j’espère que ce n’est pas toute l’équipe Flash PlatForm et Flex qui se retrouve sur le carreau. Juste pour info, le titre ADOBE (ADBE) plonge de 8% à 10h00 sur le NASDAQ : bonjour l’accueil de la nouvelle par les économistes.
    Journée de merde pour l’avenir de Flash et de Flex…

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:33 am #
  15. gludion wrote::

    If you go back to basics, it’s quite ironical that Adobe considers that light-weight, scalable graphics (multi-resolution), are not relevant for mobile.
    Well, not with Flash obviously :(

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:39 am #
  16. gludion wrote::

    huh…”What I’m truly disappointed about is that Adobe is exiting the Flash Platform business–they laid off 750 people yesterday, including the entire US-based Flash authoring tool team” —-> http://www.junglecode.net/?p=57
    can you confirm?

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:50 am #
  17. Michael Junge wrote::

    You say that “Flash developers have always created some of the most stunning, immersive, emotional experiences on the web” … I think ‘always’ should be ‘sometimes’, and all those positives are all about the content – it’s not the bling that makes a great website, and most Flash developers (and/or clients) can’t get past the bling and make websites that are loud and confusing, and that hog the CPU like it’s nobody’s business. Most Flash websites are not anything like what you describe.
    That’s why I am one of those that have ordered champagne for the office to enjoy this afternoon, after reading about the death of the Flash browser plug-in. As the web responsible part of our company we can now entirely reject our customers’ ideas of Flash driven websites.

    I do sincerely hope that the app thing will work out for you, and that the Flash/AIR products we will see in the future will be fast, lean and memory efficient.

    Cheers,
    Michael Junge

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 12:52 pm #
  18. David Mouton wrote::

    Cela aurait pu être cohérent si Adobe n’avait pas stoppé le développement de AIR sur Linux.
    Je comprend que le flash player dans un navigateur mobile n’a pas beaucoup de sens. Avec la monté en puissance des solutions basées sur HTML5 & CO c’est malheureusement l’avenir meme du flash player dans un navigateur qui est en cause. Le tuer sur mobile risque fort de le tuer egalement sur desktop.
    Promouvoir AIR pourrait apparaitre une bonne chose, après tout elle pourrait trouver sa place au coté de la JRE. Mais la JRE tourne très bien sous linux…
    Ca sent le sapin tout ça.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 12:59 pm #
  19. chris wrote::

    Adobe get your act together this is a PR mess, this decision should have been made a year ago, not show the world you are working on stage3d for mobile then fire a bunch of people and shutdown development.

    Its more logical to assume this must be about saving money more than a strategic move to focus on desktop and air.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 1:03 pm #
  20. Jules wrote::

    I’m disgusted at this decision, a total turn around after the launch of Flash Player 11. In the long term, who will develop stuff for the browser in Flash if only a portion of devices can see it? It appears that Adobe are realigning Flash as something you have to install, and Actionscript with AIR isn’t that quick, there are better options – and options that don’t involve having to install AIR in the first place for the end user. The beauty of the browser is you remove the hurdle for people to have to install things. App stores suck because you have to pay 30% of your income out straight away, and have to integrate with app stores and abide by their rules, and rules for submission. At one time we were heading towards doing everything in the browser. HTML5 is a step backwards compared to Flash and between Apples efforts and Adobes stupid decision the browser just got nerfed back to 2002. Worse, because HTML5 is a fixed spec we will be stuck with it for years to come, imagine being stuck with Actionscript 2 still? As for Adobe, well I’m turning my back – don’t expect me to renew my version of Master Collection.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 1:08 pm #
  21. Franck wrote::

    Je suis déçu, déçu, déçu. J’ai la désagréable impression de revivre la fin de Director. C’est une très mauvaise nouvelle car ne nous leurrons pas, cela signifie l’abandon à plus ou moins long terme de la technologie flash liée aux navigateurs. Comment vendre maintenant des applications Flex ou Flash online auprès de nos clients ? L’AS3 est mort, vive javascript en attendant son successeur. Bien du plaisir à nous développeurs sur une technologie multi-browser, multi-os non mature.
    Quelle gâchis, merci Adobe.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 1:44 pm #
  22. Tyler wrote::

    Please consider releasing a free, Lite version of Flash Professional. Indie developers, younger people and small groups are among the people who would benefit most from a tool that can target multiple mobile platforms. You need to get more of these people interested in Flash now, and giving them a free path to get started might help a lot. Make this THE easy path for game development.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 3:25 pm #
  23. RetroModular wrote::

    Personally I think this was a good move by Adobe, I’ve been working with Flash and AIR for long enough to know the mobile plugin isn’t of any real use any more. It’s a shame that some of the Adobe crew had to be made redundant, but I imagine that was inevitable considering the global economy is on its knees.

    Don’t let the haters get you down, Thibault :)

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 3:32 pm #
  24. Otto wrote::

    I can’t believe, that HTML5 could be an alternative in the next 5-10 years. I’m a game developer and always use Flash for my projects.

    HTML5 has not the same performance for animations (fps), neither the same functions. The open sourcecode would be bad for game-development. With SWF and obfuscators we can protect our work, but with Javascript its nearly impossible.

    On Windows every browser has different javascript-performance and different skills. Scripting stupid workarounds in HTML/JS is evil. With Flash we scripting the code one time and it runs everywhere.

    Today I read another article, that adobe plans to kill flash in near future for desktop-pcs too, cuz focusing completely on html5. Wtf?

    AIR and HTML5 are not an alternative for browsergame-development. Maybe HTML6/7, but HTML5? No way. 40% of all users worldwide still using XP – with an <IE8 (no HTML5 support). It will take another 5-6 years to bring them under 10%. We need a system to reach as many users as possible, regardless of the browserversion they are using.

    Internet Explorer has no WebGL-Support, neither in IE10 or upcoming IE11. And we want to make cool BROWSER-GAMES, no downloadable AIR-Content! So please don't stop to support Flash for Desktop-PCs within the next 10 years.. we won't change to other plugins like Unity3d.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 3:37 pm #
  25. sigman wrote::

    An all this just week before premiere of Kindle Fire that is going to have Flash Player included…

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 4:48 pm #
  26. nick wrote::

    @emrah they are not dropping ipad! app development is still unchanged on all existing platforms. Its only flash in the *mobile browser* which is being dropped..and iOS never alowed that in the first place.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 5:37 pm #
  27. Elad Elrom wrote::

    for Adobe to make case for AIR mobile this cycle needs 2 happen: product works well, used by millions & make $$ – haven’t seen it enough. With all due respect -> Machinarium, Comb over Charlie, or TweetHunt haven’t completed this cycle.

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 9:20 pm #
  28. Stan wrote::

    Are you think to opensource flash player or make joint venture only for flash player with someone as Google ? Flash player is great technology and have strong community. Should be invest more in that , not less. For HTML5 we already have a bunch of companies – Apple, Microsoft, Google …

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 10:36 pm #
  29. hayesmaker wrote::

    Well done Adobe, another massive own goal. All you’ve succeeded in doing is restart the whole Flash is dead debate big time. When are you going to realise that as soon as people believe Flash is dead, then Flash will die… Why would any company invest in Flash if Adobe don’t even want to.

    If your purpose was to make a stupid announcement which will hasten the death of Flash then well done, you have just succeeded.

    Sorry to all those who got fired by the way. Is that also a ‘good thing’ Thibault?

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 10:51 pm #
  30. nemyhlovecraft wrote::

    Thanks for posting this Thibault. I keep seeing the general press thinking that shying off mobile support is a bad thing, but as a guy who has been developing in Flash for several years what I saw was that something exciting was happening to the platform. For the first time I’m seeing Flash do something that wasn’t in direct reaction to the market, and that makes me feel like the people who are driving the tech are finally realizing the strengths of the platform and as you say “Focusing”. This along with all of the new Flash 11+ features makes me very excited to see what comes next!

    Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 11:21 pm #
  31. Hi Thibault ! So I sad that you can aproach the whole market which has an computer od mac with FlashPlayer instaled on it which is cca 99 percent. But you forget to mention that the Stage3D feature is available only for 10 Percent of these peoples, because of the lack of supporting older drivers than 2009. Really ? We want to ship our game on steam just because the Stage3D on mobile is not there yet but we would get many emails that the users cant run their game because the swift render is super slow and maybe custom blitting would be faster. Ughh. We tried on 2 years old Macbooks pro and on Intel Atom Asus EE and it fallbacks on software render which was unplayable. :( Do you feel like this is an support for existing flash developers ?

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 12:02 am #
  32. Redoc wrote::

    Thibault if Adobe is focusing on AIR as it stated why are the members of the AIR team being moved to other projects? Does Adobe really care about AIR? I mean come on, tell us the truth for once. If i look up the word incompetence in dictionary it comes with Adobe logo right behind it. :/

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 1:16 am #
  33. Adrian wrote::

    Being an advanced level Flash author, and spending the last 15 years of my life with this technology, I can tell you I have and will continue for the next while to endure some of the worst days in my career. Never before have I felt so obsolete and un-needed. It’s truly shameful what people have said with this news in both the media and our industries. It was clear to me, I need to reassess what I want to do in my career, because frankly, the web is turning into a backwards banana republic of boring experiences again. I’ve learned quickly in the last two days that the web doesn’t care if I life or die – it’s simply up to me to put myself back into the loving hands that appreciate my craft. I want to take this moment to let everyone involved with Abobe Flash and it’s tools – I truly appreciate everything you have taught me and what it takes to bring the experiences people want, right to your finger tips, unbiased of Browser version, player version OR device. You truly have made my artistry feel welcome to this medium.

    I would never turn my back on something that has given me so much love. Ever.

    I’m saddened to read that some users feel otherwise.

    Flash is the only platform that made me feel like a software / application / game / experience developer & designer at the same time. ‘Nuff said.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 4:04 am #
  34. Adrian wrote::

    … oh and one more thing, come on in to #actionscript on EFNET and let us know how you feel. We could all use the love.

    Stiego

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 4:07 am #
  35. Rick wrote::

    This is sad news.
    Thibault, you have done an excellent job with pushing Flash into new boundaries. Adobe might be thinking is saving some money but… Flash is going away from the moto “develop once, run everywhere”, which will hurt the platform all together, since none of my clients will pay for two dif versions (desktop and mobile), whhich means HTML all the way. Flash cannot match (yet) the Unity 3D, and I am not sure if developers will invest time in AIR, when the news coming from Adobe are so negative. As a developer, I will rather invest money and time into creating mobile apps in a stable platform, and at this stage the native code seems to be the way. I will watch closely the next Adobe moves, but lots of studios in Australia are now considering delaying if not cancelling the creative suites. Feels bit cold around here.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 5:06 am #
  36. Héctor wrote::

    I’m really glad of how open is Adobe with this subject. I’m saddened to see Flash for mobile die, because it’s gonna have some negative consequences, no matter how much you try to say otherwise. All the people I know love being able to play Flash content on their Androids. I know Adobe has invested a lot on this, and Apple restricting Flash use, MS seeming to not open their WP7 browser for plugins, webOs dying, Playbook lack of success, etc, etc for sure have made a big loss of money in “failed” investment. Plus this is already making uninformed people, haters, etc to spread more misinformation and giving Adobe an image of losers/moribund company/whatever. Also, while FP may not be so useful on smartphones, I think it is on tablets.

    I don’t get one thing tho, since AIR seems (or seemed when I looked at it back in the day, some custom webkit engine with FP, any work you make on porting AIR to other OSes/hardwared, isn’t reflected on the FP at the same time?

    Last and not least, I have to see a feel all of this a bit contradictory, you plan on making AIR the “develop once, deploy everywhere” tool everyone around here wants, but I somewhat think that already cannot be since AIR for Linux is dead…

    Sorry for my long comment.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 10:24 am #
  37. Héctor wrote::

    “I have to see a feel all of this a bit contradictory” meant “I feel all of this is a bit contradictory”. Forgot to comment that while smartphones use may not be signifact yet, it could be earlier than anyone thinks.

    Well, I also agree this may be rather good news. Flash still has a lot to offer to the developer community, plus some of its authoring tools are the best to get some work done, so I hope Adobe is correctly redirecting all its resources to make this new direction even better than what we were already seeing.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 10:30 am #
  38. Héctor wrote::

    @Rick
    “since none of my clients will pay for two dif versions (desktop and mobile)”
    Sorry, but I fail to see how that wasn’t already happening.
    All the people were already either:

    - Making two or more versions of a web/app.
    - Making just a single HTML version, which had either a big cost, or was worse than initially expected.
    - Making a single Flash version and completely ignoring a lot of devices, and for some like the iPhone, giving sometimes a native app since a web isn’t possible.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 10:42 am #
  39. Thibault Imbert wrote::

    Hi Clint,

    The Flash Pro team has been reorganized but we are going to still invest in it and we want to make Flash Pro a great tool targeting gaming.
    Mike Chambers recently posted a few things about what we are doing with Flash Pro : http://www.mikechambers.com/blog/2011/11/10/flash-professional-and-the-future/

    Hi tlecoz,

    Stage3D will not be supported on mobile browsers because Stage3D is not part of the features for Flash Player 11 mobile.

    Hi Nicolas,

    Yes, could have been better :)

    Hi Nick,

    Thanks! We will keep building tools and solutions that allow you guys to do that.

    Hi Matthew,

    We have plans, big plans. We cannot share too much for now. But we will as soon as possible. And when we will, we want it to be truly cool and exciting.

    Hi Diablo,

    Bye bye Flash Player on mobile browsers :)

    Salut Phil,

    On a connu mieux niveau journee, mais c’est une bonne nouvelle pour ce que l’on veut faire avec Flash pour le futur.
    Je ne peux pas commenter sur Flex, c’est une autre equipe qui gere sa communication. Mais je pense sincerement que continuer a investir sur Flash Player sur mobile
    etait une erreur. AIR etant beaucoup plus interessant en terme d’usage/besoin.

    Maintenant, je reconnais, que les medias, ne font pas la difference entre Flash Player et AIR, c’est ca le vrai souci, et donc pour eux, et le grand public, cela veut dire
    plus de Flash sur mobile du tout.

    Hi Gludion,

    More details here : http://www.mikechambers.com/blog/2011/11/10/flash-professional-and-the-future/

    Hi Michael,

    It is not that easy. Good Flash websites are not resource hog, and if they are, that’s often because they push the limits of what can be delivered through a browser. Like thefwa.com
    Doing the same websites in HTML/JS will be the same resource issue, as long as your content is expressive and complex. But for mobile, I agree, cool you prefer AIR.

    Salut David,

    Avec un focus sur le jeu, Linux n’est pas vraiment une priorite. On va continuer a innover sur le Flash Player sur desktop car il ya une demande, et HTML5 est loin d’etre pret. Si HTML5 arrive au meme niveau tant mieux on aura fait avancer
    les choses. Sur mobile, meme probleme, le gens veulent les meilleures performances, et c’est ce sur quoi on se focalise, surtout pour le jeu. Encore une fois, si on doit changer l’implementation pour arriver aux meilleures perfs on le fera.
    Au final je suis confiant que le developpeur ActionScript transitionnera toujours sur une nouvelle solution si celle ci lui apporte de meilleurs resultats.

    Hi Jules,

    People develop games for the destkop and specifically develop for mobile, the idea of running the same SWF on desktop and then mobile, just does not work. We have been there.
    What you want as a developer, is use ActionScript to develop the game code and deliver two versions of it sharing the same source code slightly modified to fit
    the requirements of a mobile device (size, Ui simplificiation, touch, etc).

    I agree with what you say about the app store model, but we are not going to be on iOS, so would people target Flash Player on mobile browsers for Android ? I don’t see that.

    HTML5 is just not enough mature for advanced stuff like games, hence why on desktop, Flash Player is just the best way to reach everyone with the best results. On mobile, today it is standalone apps.

    Salut Franck,

    Je suis d’accord, sur l’impact que ce genre d’annonces peut avoir. AS3 n’est pas mort, et si jamais il l’etait il renaitrait sous une autre forme :)

    Hi Tyler,

    This is not a bad idea. I love Flash Pro and it still the best tool for animators who work in game development. I will relay that suggestion.

    Hi Si,

    Nice to hear your thoughts ;) Yes, we need to focus on what is essential to make the platform really successful.

    Hi Otto,

    I agree! But wait, we are not saying go HTML for everything! Seriously for video or games, it is Flash. And today the best way to deliver those experiences
    is through the model that works which are standalone apps with AIR. For mobile in-browser experiences, I think it will be HTML5. That is unfortunately the price to pay with iOS.

    Hi sigman,

    Agreed, but it will support AIR ;)

    Hi Elad,

    Agreed, we need to do more, and show and prove it works rather than tell.

    Hi Stan,

    No, no plans to open source the player for now.

    Hi hayesmaker,

    Definitely not, seeing friends leaving the building is always tough…
    I am sorry but Flash Player on mobile browsers just made us look bad, not great. And I prefer not seeing Flash running at all that seeing it run badly.
    At least people will bitch about that decision, but not Flash.

    Hi nemyhlovecraft,

    Great to hear you understand the direction!

    Hi Jaroslav,

    Yes, we will slowly smoothen the blacklisting for HW Stage3D, but we had to do this for the initial release.
    For the next versions of Flash Player on desktop, we plan including a mechanism allowing us to do that remotely, without having to ship a new build.
    For now, you will have to design your content accordingly, and detect that you are running in software and adapt your graphics.

    Hi Redoc,

    In every reorg in a company, it happens that people decide to move to new projects. It happened in the Flash Player and AIR teams. The fact that people transition and go to new opportunities, does not necessarily means that what they are leaving is dead.

    Hi Adrian,

    Great comment, seriously. I want you to know that whatever the outcome of all this.
    We will always fulfill the promise of Flash, whatever the implementation we take, plugin, standalone, or whatever.
    Our goal is to allow people like you to keep developing content like you have always done.
    Using one language and one set of APIs to target as much devices and screens as possible.

    Hi Rick,

    We will have to make AIR amazing. Have the performance that people expect or could not believe they would get.
    I think we will see a lot of people developing games for desktop using Flash Player, cause it is just the best way to do it.
    For mobile, they would have to develop a specfici version anyway. And for this they can use AIR.
    If they want to be in the browser, they will use HTML/JS, and unfortuntely that is the price to pay to be in iOS browser.

    Thanks for your comments guys,

    Thibault

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 10:54 am #
  40. Jesus wrote::

    Hi Thibault,
    Everybody is talking about the future of the flash platform and the flash profesional tool, Im a Flex developer working in a company that now is scared about the future of our tools and applications.

    If the player is targeting gaming… what is the future of flex??? you have to explain this clearly because we are spending money and time y your technology.
    How long is going to live the player on desktops if the browsers kick the plugins out??
    Thanks.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 12:39 pm #
  41. mth wrote::

    Great post! I don’t get it why everyone is crying that Flash is dead. In one of the news I’ve even seen information that Adobe is considering Flash obsolete and moves to modern and super-duper HTML5 ;-)

    In my opinion it is the right move. Now we have a clear separation between Flash apps made for desktops and for mobiles and it is great. Desktops shouldn’t adjust to mobiles!

    But! If it is now clearly separated can we have some hope that Stage 3D APIs will move on and will be expanded with new features such as 3D textures, richer instruction set for AGAL etc.?

    DirectX 9.0c is a standard for years. Decision to stick with original DirectX 9.0 feature set had a lot of sense yesterday, but now not. We, Flash developers should have the possibility to squeeze more out of the hardware in the desktops! For mobile versions of apps it is not a problem to stick with that what is now as we will anyway have to create separate versions for them.

    Do that and Flash will completely dominate the Unity 3D! :-)

    I will greatly appreciate clarifying your statement on that subject as it made me wonder whole day yesterday.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 12:41 pm #
  42. Markus wrote::

    1: No, no, no – no. Android is starting to invade the desktop sphere. With the Asus Transformers and other tablets, we aboslutley need the Flashplayer, not for the mobile experience, but for the *desktop* experience.

    It got mouse, keyboard and a good screen.

    I can get that you quit the failing platforms, but you GOTTA support android webplayer. Android 4.0 is not just “mobile”.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 1:19 pm #
  43. Markus wrote::

    Again, you gotta finish the stage3D for android web, we har creating solutions that would absolutley rock on the android tablets. But we need starling to get it to work smoothly.

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 1:31 pm #
  44. Goach wrote::

    Salut Thibo !

    Bien avant l’histoire iOS, la réputation du Flash Player avait déjà souffert des difficultés de référencement( même si des solutions existent). Mais il y a une grande différence entre la réputation qu’a une technologie et la technologie elle-même et c’est la que le bas blesse :(

    Un commercial, suite à cette annonce, n’osera plus proposer autant cette technologie auprès de ces clients… tout simplement !

    Je pense que le Flash va se réorienter surtout autour du jeu, maintenant que de bonnes performances sont au rendez vous, et beaucoup moins sur de l’applicatif ou du site immersif.

    Fini les sites de marques !!!

    ++

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 3:29 pm #
  45. Manu wrote::

    L’avis d’un simple amateur…

    Moi j’ai découvert flash en 2004 avec la version MX quand on mettait des scripts un peu partout j avait très vite aime ce super logiciel mais faute de temps j’ai du abandonner. Je l’ai redécouvert
    il y a deux ans,j’ai passe tout mon temps libre a le réapprendre ainsi que l’as3,et le plaisir que me procure la flash plate-forme est immense simple amateur que je suis. La moindre chose que je fait
    aussi simple soit telle me donne beaucoup de satisfaction,mais quand j’ai apprit cette nouvelle comme beaucoup d’entre vous ma journée fut gachee. Un peu partout sur le net je lissait des articles
    pourrit “le flash est mort”,”as3 c’est finit”etc etc…Pour ma part je continuerait a apprendre ce fabuleux outils et je suis pas prêt d’enlever mes livres as3 qui sont sur ma table de nuit.
    Je pense que flash vivra tant que des gens comme vous (professionnels) ou simplement comme moi simple amateur le porteront encore dans leur cœur.
    I LOVE FLASH:)

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 4:52 pm #
  46. tlecoz wrote::

    Hello Thibault !
    “Stage3D will not be supported on mobile browsers because Stage3D is not part of the features of Flash Player 11.”

    ????????????
    http://www.adobe.com/products/flashplayer

    sur l’image principale on peut lire
    “See how Stage3D brings console-quality game for the web”

    Juste en dessous, dans la rubrique “Top new features in Flash Player”

    “Stage 3D accelerated graphics rendering*
    Explore a new architecture for high-performance 2D/3D GPU hardware accelerated graphics rendering by Adobe, which provides low-level Stage3D APIs for advanced rendering in apps and gives framework developers classes of interactive experiences”

    Comment peux tu dire que cette propriété ne fais pas parti du FP11 alors que c’est LA fonctionnalité que vous avez mis le plus en avant depuis le MAX de l’année dernière, et c’est évidemment LA fonctionnalité que tout le monde attend(ais…).

    Je m’attendais vraiment à tout sauf à cette réponse…

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 5:21 pm #
  47. Thibault Imbert wrote::

    Salut tlecoz,

    Stage3D est une feature introduite dans Flash Player 11 desktop. Stage3D n’est pas une fonctionnalite qui fait part de Flash Player 11 mobile.

    J’ai corrige mon commentaire plus haut pour qu’il n’y ait pas de confusion.

    Thibault

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 9:40 pm #
  48. zburns wrote::

    What a kind of stupid management decision! Probably driven by people without technology-background, but that seems typically and nothing new!

    I think this will be a lose-lose situation for Adobe! It will not lose just on Mobile, after this statement now also on Desktop! Apps and Games are not all! But okay, that’s not my problem…

    But one statement makes me a bit angry – especially because I bought an Android tablet in the hope to use Stage3D there soon – INSIDE the browser! not as app!:

    Quote: “Stage3D will not be supported on mobile browsers because Stage3D is not part of the features of Flash Player 11.”

    Not a part of Flashplayer 11?
    How would you call it then?

    And some months ago the Stage3D was announced to be released on Android in the first half of 2012!!! What about that now?

    Friday, November 11, 2011 at 9:54 pm #
  49. Héctor wrote::

    I think at least Stage3D support should be added before abandoning the mobile player.

    Well, I also think AIR for Linux should have been abandoned after a 64bits release.

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 1:09 am #
  50. David Smith wrote::

    I love my mobile device. I love Flash. I am a die-hard fan of the Flash platform and have also spent countless hours, literally years, in my seat developing and learning more and more about the Flash platform and its capabilities. I feel a pang of discouragement when I hear someone say negative things about Flash (other developers unfamiliar with Flash and the media alike) and just want to yell, “You don’t know what its capable of!!! Flash is so much more than what you think it is!!!!”.

    That being said… I think it’s important to recognize that this is not about battery power, frame rates and other conversation pieces that are brought into the heated discussion, and more about usability patterns and what a user expects from a piece of software on a certian piece of hardware. I also think it’s a question of resource dedication.

    First, I think about usabilty and user experience in relation to how I use my mobile device. I don’t really USE the browser on my mobile device as anything more than a last resort to be used on the rare occasion that an APP I have with a dedicated purpose won’t do what I want AT THE TIME. And lets be honest… almost anything (I would say anything but I know that can’t be true) that is not specifically designed with the mobile experience in mind SUCKS on a mobile device.

    The mobile experience and the desktop/laptop experience are just NOT the same thing. If they were, we would all be satisfied with 800×600 monitors on our desktops, not the setups like the 1920×1080 24″ dual-monitor setup that I am writing this on right now.

    Do I wish the standard Flash runtime performed as well as a native app on a mobile device?
    YES.

    Do I see the power of what I’ve learned, as well as the amount of time I’ve dedicated to learning it, and wish that I could simply take what I know and not have to learn anything new to tailor it to mobile?
    OF COURSE!

    Is a part of me pretty irritated that a bunch of Flash haters will feel a smug and ill-informed sense of See-I-Told-Ya-So?
    ABSO-FRIGGIN-LUTELY

    Do I very sincerely want (and know that there will be) a vibrant future for the technology and my fellow developers?
    YES!!!!!

    My next thought is about the dedication of resources. I wan’t Adobe to spend it’s resources on things that will further the technology and therefore affirm the value of the time I’ve poured into it. I don’t really care if the Flash runtime works in a mobile browser because I don’t use my mobile browser the way I use my non-mobile machines. This is about development of the FLASH PLAYER FOR MOBILE not Flash and certainly not the underlying technology.

    END OF DIATRIBE

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 1:17 pm #
  51. Jesus wrote::

    Im an enterprise developer focused on Flex. The Flex team said that flex is going to be contributed to an open software fundation and a lot of SDK developers inside Adobe are moving to HTML5 projects. How do you supose any company is going to support flex??? if even adobe is leaving it.
    If you are investing on Adobe Air apps, why do you change the Flex development model?? I dont understand this move, can you explain it?

    How the new player features are going to be implemented on the SDK if you are moving the resources out??

    I think adobe is losing the north and is going to lose all the developers comunity.

    Im a Project Manager and I think my next move in my company is to leave your technology in all the projects I manage.

    Thanks Adobe (The new gaming company).

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 1:18 pm #
  52. Fred DUFAU wrote::

    Ok les gars, moi je vais me faire l’avocat du diable, mais je trouve que cette news est

    une bonne news et j’avoue que je ne comprends pas trop les reactions de la communauté.
    L’abandon du flash player sur mobile ne fait qu’entériner une situation qui existe dans

    la réalité : flash n’existe pas sur smartphone ou tablette aujourd’hui.
    Alors oui on a vu des démos de trucs qui tournent pas trop mal sur galaxy tab, mais on

    a rien de rien sur ios.
    Deuxiement, ca entérine aussi l’expérience utilisateur sur mobile ou tablette : en gros

    si je veux du contenu, j’ouvre safari (ou autre) et je veux que ca aille vite, que ce

    soit écrit gros et que je ne galére pas trop à trouver l’info; ou alors je veux une

    vraie expérience et alors je sais que je dois me tourner vers les apps.
    Mais tout ça est déja le cas aujourd’hui, si je veux commander un truc sur amazon via

    ipad ou iphone, je ne vais pas aller me casser les yeux dans safari, je chope l’appli

    et go !
    Aujourd’hui les projets de site fullflash sur lesquels je travaille sont taillé

    d’entrée de jeu pour du 1920×1200 avec un resize minimale autour de 800×600, mais à

    800×600 le site n’a plus rien à voir avec la créa originale.
    Donc c’est un état de fait, on ne peut pas avoir le meme site pour 1920×1200 que pour

    un mobile. De plus l’ergonomie tactile est tellement différente de l’ergo pensée pour

    la souris que c’est vraiment un mythe de croire qu’on va passer le meme site sur

    toutes les plateformes.
    Je ne vois pas non plus pourquoi le fait de ne pas faire de flash sur mobile, inciterai

    les clients à ne plus vouloir de flash du tout. C’est comme de dire que le fait de ne

    pas pouvoir faire des jeux de ouf en html5/js, condamnerait le html5/js ?
    Enfin, je ne vois pas en quoi cette décision favoriserait le html5/js pour remplacer la

    niche des sites flashs actuels. Le html5/js est encore trés loin en terme de capacité

    par rapport à flash et développer en js, pour moi c’est comme revenir aux début de

    l’AS.
    Et enfin, les mecs, on a attendu pendant des années d’avoir le gpu avec Flash, et ben

    faut y aller, faites péter les démos, à nous de démontrer encore que les sites en flash

    c’est de la tuerie, on a maintenant les moyens de le faire !
    Et vraiment pour les pessimistes, moi je ne considére pas que flash m’a permis de

    devenir uniquement développeur flash mais il m’a permis de devenir développeur

    multimédia, donc si un jour faut juste changer d’outil pour continuer à faire son

    boulot, je ne vois pas où est le probléme ? si ce n’est cette petite part de romantisme

    qui traine quand on travaille avec flash depuis plusieurs années ? ;-)
    Enfin la seule vraie galère c’est qu’il va falloir à nouveau tout expliquer aux clients

    sur les possibilités de flash par rapport aux mobiles, on peut faire des apps mais de

    flash dans le nav,… euh attendez ben en fait c’est comme avant, sauf que maintenant

    c’est sur on ne pourra jamais le faire.

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 6:32 pm #
  53. hayesmaker wrote::

    This is another Adobe PR disaster, nothing else.

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 6:36 pm #
  54. Spencer wrote::

    Would it make since not to keep developing AIR for mobile and just have native application compilers to all platforms? Especially with all these new platforms coming into the market trying to have a stranglehold on anything to do with their hardware or OS.

    Saturday, November 12, 2011 at 10:56 pm #
  55. devu wrote::

    Regarding to this:

    “it doesn’t matter that no-one was really crafting mobile Flash experiences.” It’s a bullshit. I was even asking Adobe for founding (There was Open Screen Project 2 years ago) to be able to abandon my freelance work and fully concentrate on this project:

    http://www.flaemo.com

    Here is my final post on my blog
    http://flaemo.com/blog/?p=344

    I know several people interesting in this particular area. We have been screwed completely. Not to mention that my 2 regular flash job contracts has been cancelled yesterday.

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 1:36 am #
  56. devu wrote::

    Regarding to AIR improvements for Mobile platforms. Yes, that’s great to have it. To get close to native speed etc. No one could disagree with that. And I believe all Flash developers would be very happy to see just this part of announcement alone.

    However, Adobe please convince me your tool going to be more efficient than native API like C or Android API. How can I trust company like you after all this and investing another 1+ year in something I will be completely depend on you? I would rather take a look at existing native tool-set and forget about AS3 at all!

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 1:53 am #
  57. Diablo wrote::

    How is the programming model will now be recommended? previously it was the example Flex Mobile -> AIR and now?
    from what I read it mocks Adobe Flex and puts it in the hands of others … it looks like it looks but does not have to hide it from Adobe flex washes his hands ….

    What programming model for adobe AIR now see? pure AS3?

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 11:06 am #
  58. PHFD wrote::

    Adobe very very disappointed because a lot of people spent a lot of time believing what the evangelist said it appeared that it went largely for naught

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 11:10 am #
  59. PHFD wrote::

    HTML 5 is now the only good way, unless someone wants to disappoint again on adobe

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 11:11 am #
  60. Amon wrote::

    What’s about Flex Thibo? There is big fuss about it over the Internet. Is there any official statement?

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 11:23 am #
  61. RazorX wrote::

    HTML5 just means developers will be going back to 90′s style coding in JavaScript (jQuery). The problem is that interactivity in JavaScript is far far below what Flash can deliver currently. The HTML5 movement will be known as the Web’s Dark Age.

    JavaScript is also a much larger “security risk” than Flash by about 3 times. We all know it is much safer to cruise the Web without JavaScript on.

    The new “Turn off JavaScript for a Safer Web” campaign is coming. We will teach users how to turn the JavaScript plug-in off in their browsers, and then we will see how interactive HTML5 is without its much needed crutch of JavaScript!

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 5:19 pm #
  62. Erick Correa wrote::

    You guys this a excellent move and makes optimistic for the future.

    What you guys dont realize is FP 11 is going to be a whole new level of intensity to the web. Even with FP11 on mobile there’s no way mobile devices could handle intense graphic manipulation.

    When the time comes (within next years) mobile device hardware will be powerful enough to handle Flash graphics and I gaureentee you

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 8:44 pm #
  63. Erick Correa wrote::

    You guys this an excellent move and makes me optimistic for the future.

    What you guys dont realize is FP 11 is going to be a whole new level of intensity to the web. Even with FP11 on mobile there’s no way mobile devices could handle intense graphic manipulation.

    When the time comes (within next years) mobile device hardware will be powerful enough to handle Flash graphics and I guarantee you flash will be back on mobile better than EVER!

    But for now Adobe gotta make maneuvers to keep the Flash project alive until mobile devices are better

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 8:46 pm #
  64. Mmmarti wrote::

    please answer this very important:

    1. What about Flash CATALIST?
    2. The truth about the Flex and Flash Builder?

    3. what CS6 package? whether it be a waste of money as soon flex sdk 4.6 release, I guess that it will be officially CS6 package ….

    according to your opinions in the long run HTML5 will be better BUT CS6 new package will be released soon ….

    do we have to understand that the CS6 package would be a waste of money? and soon will not use tools CATALIST, FLEX, etc … ?

    please honest answer

    Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 10:23 pm #
  65. anon wrote::

    You say:
    “We have plans, big plans. We cannot share too much for now. But we will as soon as possible. And when we will, we want it to be truly cool and exciting.”

    I understand the need to be all cool and exciting when you make an announcement, but it will be for nought if by then your user base has abandoned you based on Adobe’s incompetence last week. Based on the reaction on the web, if you dont act now and produce a clear roadmap that can get people excited about committing to AIR using the Flex SDK (pure AS3 is nice, but not enough), you will loose a significant number of users, who BTW will keep this in mind whenever they need to pick the next HTML5 toolkit for their front-end work. Sure if you produce something kick-ass on the HTML5 front, better than Apple, Microsoft, Google, Dojo, Sencha, Jquery…etc. you have a chance, but otherwise, your treatment of your developers last week, will serve as a ringing endorsement not to pick an Adobe developer toolkit ever again.

    Monday, November 14, 2011 at 2:40 am #
  66. Groinko wrote::

    I started using Flash in 1999. But now, who’s still doing Flash websites? Rare people for rare websites. OK, maybe games developers will target Flash Player or surely WebGL… Yes, we have to go deeply in HTML5 et JS = no problem.
    But, what about Air? Will it be available on Win8 Metro? Or do we have to go HTML5 anyway?
    Bon, c’est un peu triste tout ça, au moment où tu viens moderniser le lecteur, on le tue, vraiment dommage parce que tu assures !

    Monday, November 14, 2011 at 1:01 pm #
  67. Raph wrote::

    Cette décision est une catastrophe. Le flash player mobile tel qu’il est maintenant est tout à fait capable. J’ai écrit une app AS3 qui tourne sur desktop, navigateur mobile et qui compile en app air pour android. Cette appli est bien sur plus avancée que ce qu’on peut espérer avec HTML5 en tout point. Notre stratégie est d’utiliser la même appli sur mobile et desktop. L’adaptation nous a couté déjà 3 mois de dev. Maintenant on doit tout repenser à cause de l’indécision d’Adobe qui nous a donné le flashplayer mobile puis se rétracte. Vous avez piétinés la confiance que les éditeurs avaient en vous.
    Pour moi les webapp sont sur le point de revenir en force, contre les app installée, et au même moment adobe change d’avis. On pourra toujours compiler des apps pour nos clients mais les visiteurs ne pourront plus avoir d’accès direct à un contenu hébergé développé en flash. Je vois 2 intérêts importants d’utiliser flash : multi plateforme et l’efficacité du développement as3. On peut donc oublier le multi plateforme à partir d’aujourd’hui.
    Adobe a déjà fait une grosse erreur à l’origine avec air en obligeant d’installer le runtime séparément, ce qui enlevait énormément d’intérêt à cette solution. Ensuite les développeur pur as3 n’ont jamais eu d’outil dédié de la part d’adobe. Flex étant centré sur le framework et ses composant et flash étant dédié au design animation car son éditeur de script est toujours aussi naze. Personnellement je trouve flex lourd et rigide, on peut même pas faire plusieurs projets dans le même dossier ! vive la multiplication des checkout / ressources, bravo pour le multi plateforme. Adobe aura-t-il un jour une bonne stratégie ? Quand macromedia a été acheté par Adobe j’étais sur que flash allait disparaitre, Adobe est il en train de réussir?
    Comment pouvez vous annoncer l’abandon d’un produit avant même d’avoir présenté l’alternative. M’aurait on caché que dreamweaver permet d’intégrer tous les type de média y compris de l’animation, le tout optimisé pour mobile en HTML5. M’aurait on caché que tous les navigateur supportent correctement le html5/css3 (même sur android base sur le même webkit, les perfs sont très loin de ios…).
    Donc dès aujourd’hui, le développement pour le browser mobile est revenu 10 ans en arrière, merci Adobe.

    Monday, November 14, 2011 at 3:34 pm #
  68. tom wrote::

    @FredDUFAU +1

    Monday, November 14, 2011 at 5:14 pm #
  69. jloa wrote::

    If the stop of mobile player support will result in increase of the air support (more performance, further deeper android api implementation etc) = i’m for it!

    Monday, November 14, 2011 at 8:01 pm #
  70. pdc wrote::

    so sad!

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 5:20 am #
  71. Markus wrote::

    Quote Erick Correa: “What you guys dont realize is FP 11 is going to be a whole new level of intensity to the web. Even with FP11 on mobile there’s no way mobile devices could handle intense graphic manipulation.”

    Well, the problem is that Android is a part of this web. And with the upcoming hardware like Tegra 3, the platform actually will soon have capable hardware as well.

    Android is getting too big to ignore, and Adobe has finally made a decent player. It makes no sense to quit Android web now.

    Quote Thibault: “Existing content for desktops didn’t always look as magical on phones as people were used to seeing with Flash Player on their desktops. Content optimized for desktops with big screens and beefy processors can’t look as good on a phone or a tablet it was never designed for. This really had an impact on the trust that people had in Flash, and this perception made it hard to start new projects optimized for mobile browsers. There was just no appetite to even try doing this.”

    That is a pretty premature comment. How long has the Flashplayer existed on mobile? Our apetite for mobile is just starting to materialize! We have our first project that targets mobile flash on the web scheduled for Q2 next year.

    We have just learned to appreciate flash on the android web now the last 6 months – after a abit buggy start. You don’t look at the big picture, where I am sure mobile flash web would have picked up.

    Only the problem now is that developers and customers have enough to cope with all the new platforms and paradigms. Until now, “Apps” have had all the hype, but we see the trends that many wants to fall back to the mobile web now, with HTML5 being the big buzzword, but in my opinion Flash would have been the big performer in many specific cases. We could have prooved everyone wrong by 2014, and I am certain Microsoft Metro would have been in on it by then. By 2015, Apple iOS would have to follow suit, or become an outdated platform.

    But now Adobe just prematurely hit the trigger and shot themselves in the face, and we will never know what ‘could have been’ =(

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 2:16 pm #
  72. Juan Estevas Javier wrote::

    Shantanu Narayen greeted the Flash community with his left hand, show their discontent by signing the petition created by Peter Elst:

    http://www.change.org/petitions/adobe-systems-shantanu-narayen-to-step-down-as-ceo

    “Why This Is Important

    The announcements on November 9th 2011 around Flash Platform technology – and the way in which communication happened – have caused irrefutable damage to developers and stakeholders worldwide.

    As CEO, Shantanu Narayen has shown a complete disregard for customers and his lack of leadership has resulted in widespread chaos and uncertainty.

    It is time for Adobe to move on under a new CEO and regain the trust of its user base and community.”

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 4:20 pm #
  73. Tyler wrote::

    Well, I think Adobe has been in danger of being the jack of all trades, master of none with Flash. Since Flash can’t be ubiquitous, it needs to be outstanding on the platforms where it does exist in order to create a case for itself.

    My question is, for the areas that Adobe is now focusing Flash, are they in it to win it? Is Adobe going to try to compete with Unity and other platforms that address the same audiences to try to be the best? If Adobe is serious about trying to be the best platform for their stated use cases, I’ll stick with them.

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 6:34 pm #
  74. eric wrote::

    we need hints to find how to, for example:
    port alivePdf to JS/HTML 5,
    Bitmapdata class,
    ByteArray class…

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 8:39 pm #
  75. David Barlia wrote::

    Hey Thibault,

    What’s the status of project Wallaby? I’ve been saying for a long time that the probable way forward for Flash as a web content development tool would be to publish straight to HTML5.

    On the other hand, there are those who think that browsers and websites as we know them today will eventually die out and be replaced by apps. I’m gradually coming round to that point of view myself.

    Best,
    David

    Tuesday, November 15, 2011 at 10:30 pm #
  76. Dimon wrote::

    “We are not stepping out of the mobile space with Flash, we are just focusing on what makes sense and where Flash looks great, standalone apps with AIR”

    How would you explain the Flex SDK outsourcing, then? Isn’t it a best tool to build standalone apps with AIR?! Can you please shed the light if the AIR build model, which are effectively AS3 + either Flash Professional | Flex SDK | Flash Builder will survive or not? And which of those tools will survive the mess we are all in now? Thanks!

    Wednesday, November 16, 2011 at 2:05 am #
  77. Thibault Imbert wrote::

    Hi hayesmaker,

    Agreed. And we are conscious about this. We truly want to make to sure this never happens again.

    Hi Spencer,

    Of course this could be a solution. We will then make everything possible to bring you back to our platform.
    This is the reason why we are investigating a lot of new ways of implementing what we do today.

    Hi Devu,

    I think at this point, you guys maybe do not believe us anymore. And with the recent PR mess, I can understand the hesitation.
    To be 100% sincere, I think we need to move away from the tell, and just show. This is the only way to change the perception.

    Hi Diablo,

    The Flex team posted an update, Flex will be handed to open-source through the Spoon project. Adobe will also keep working on it :
    http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html

    Hi PHFD,

    Yes, the announcement came up brutally. Without explanations about why we are doing this.
    I think HTML5 will be great for some things like mobile web apps. The issue is when you want to get close to native performance and get
    a great level of integration it gets harder.

    Hi Amon,

    Yes, there has been an update posted today :
    http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html

    Hi RazorX,

    That would be a funny campaign :)

    Hi Erick,

    Yes, we need now to deliver the best performance on AIR for mobile.

    Hi Mmmarti,

    For Flex : http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html
    For Flash Builder we have a team, they will work on it to make it a great ActionScript coding tool.
    Maybe with less focus on Flex development, more like the tool an ActionScript coder would use.

    Hi Anon,

    And we are working actively, so that we can share this roadmap asap. Clearly our priority right now.

    Hi Groinko,

    Still a large number of people use Flash for websites. Trust me! Not saying it is always good, but, yes a lot of marketing stuff still does.
    We want you guys to use AIR for going to Win8 Metro, and all other platforms. But to convince you, it needs to perform great. Clearly our priority today.
    Merci pour le soutien! FP sur desktop est loin d’etre mort, et le futur de Flash sur mobile c’est AIR ou peut etre meme quelque chose d’autre venant de notre equipe ne s’appelant pas forcement AIR! ;)

    Hi Raph,

    Je comprends la frustration.
    Je pense sincerement que la majorite des projest realises en Flex aujourd’hui sont realisables en HTML.
    Pour la partie AIR, AIR 3 integre le captive runtime permettant de ne pas avoir a installer le runtime a l’avance. Le runtime est embarque dans l’application.
    Pour la partie coding, je suis d’accord que Flash Builder n’a pas vraiment satisfait les devs AS3. Perso, je n’utilise pas Flash Builder.
    L’equipe va devoir me convaincre de passer a Flash Builder, c’est le defi que je leur donne :)

    Hi jloa,

    Me too :)

    Hi Markus,

    That is a good point. Although, we never really saw any interest in Flash Player on mobile browsers hence why the focus has been done on AIR.
    Now maybe we will be proven wrong in the future, but right now if we had to concentrate our efforts one way to deliver Flash content on mobile devices, we would choose AIR.

    Hi Juan,

    As you can imagine, I cannot really comment on this :)

    Hi Tyler,

    Yes, we are serious about this. Really.

    Hi eric,

    You could actually port all that. All possible!

    Hi David,

    We just announced that FalconJS, the compiler used for that would be open sourced too : http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html
    I dont know from a tooling standpoint what it means for Flash Pro.

    Hi Dimon,

    Flash Builder does not move, we are going to make it a great AS3 editing tool. Focus more on the ActionScript coding experience rather than focusing a lot on the Flex workflow.
    Flex is going to be given to Spoon and Adobe will also participate : http://blogs.adobe.com/flex/2011/11/your-questions-about-flex.html

    Thibault

    Wednesday, November 16, 2011 at 10:58 am #
  78. Hugues FREI wrote::

    Bonjour Thibault,

    J’ai du mal à comprendre, relier et même croire les récentes annonces d’Adobe concernant Flash à Adobe !

    Je comprends bien aussi que ta parole ne peut pas vraiment s’écarter de la doctrine officielle actuelle.
    Je ne rédige donc ce message que pour te faire remonter des perceptions au cas où elles pourraient aider éventuellement à ne pas tout jeter trop vite dans les bijoux de famille de Flash.

    D’un coté Adobe annonce 750 suppressions de postes
    sans dire quelles équipes sont concernées ni à quelle hauteur et de l’autre Adobe annonce aujourd’hui uniquement l’arrêt du développement des plug-in Flash Player sur tous les navigateurs mobiles (y compris RIM et Android) avec la mise en place prochaine d’un palliatif bas de gamme pour le web mobile en HTML5 + javascript + CSS avec Edge et avec le rachat de PhoneGap.

    Avec ça, on se retrouve donc très en dessous des possibilités offertes précédemment grâce aux plug-ins Flash Player pour les navigateurs mobiles et il y a bien là une très nette “régression” qui ne peut que durer vu que Adobe n’est pas maître du rythme d’évolution du HTML5. Où est le positif là dedans ? je ne le vois pas.

    Combien de personnes sont concernées par le développement des plug-in pour les nav. mobiles ?
    Sur les 750 suppressions de postes, combien concernent Flash de près ou de loin ?
    Et combien restera-t-il de personnes dans les équipes Flash après cette “saignée” et pour combien de temps encore ?

    Comment être sûr que les 750 départs annoncés ne vont pas avoir d’autres conséquences négatives, pas encore annoncées celles là, sur le futur de la Flash Platform à Adobe malgré les messages rassurants destinés à calmer les esprits et la grosse crise de confiance qu’on connaît en ce moment du fait des décisions abruptes d’Adobe.

    Les mobiles sont l’avenir du web, d’accord ?

    Le “web gaming” a toujours un grand avenir et aussi avec le “web gaming sur mobiles”, d’accord ?

    Flash serait orienté “gaming” mais sans pouvoir faire de “web gaming sur mobiles” ? alors que c’est l’avenir ?

    Mais si Flash est mis “out” du web mobile, ce n’est pas HTML5 qui pourra vraiment le remplacer car il en est très loin et ne peut avancer que très lentement, d’accord ?

    Alors où est l’intérêt pour le futur d’Adobe et de Flash ?

    Uniquement faire davantage de “bénéfices” avec des outils web mobile “bas de gamme” et moins coûteux à développer que Flash ? malgré nos prix de licences extrêmement élevés ? et tous les développeurs qui ont tant misé sur Flash sur le web dont le futur est sur mobiles !

    Ma déception et mon inquiétude sont énormissimes !

    Merci en tout cas à toi pour tes précieux conseils en développement AS3 optimisé et pour tout ce que tu pourras faire pour faciliter la vie aux développeurs Flash
    dans tous les domaines et au business de développement Flash.

    Wednesday, November 16, 2011 at 3:15 pm #
  79. Chris wrote::

    If this wasn’t about saving money why wouldn’t Adobe hire new talent for their HTML5 ambitions? Instead some of the genius behind the devs of the flash player are being forced to follow this HTML5 fashion statement imposed by Apple and others.

    Dropping Linux Air support, drop flash mobile support, drop flex. What is next? The flash community needs some good news.

    Thursday, November 17, 2011 at 11:12 am #
  80. David Barlia wrote::

    Suppose I make a website for desktop Flash Player. Then I use most of the exact same code and assets to make a variation for mobile AIR. It is possible for a website to detect whether a visitor is on desktop or mobile — so isn’t it possible that a website might allow a mobile visitor to launch the AIR version of that website?

    If the answer is ‘yes’ (or maybe will be ‘yes’ at some point in the near future?) then I think this pattern of work would answer a lot of people’s concerns.

    …but I suppose iOS is still going to be the problem. Would FalconJS come to the rescue and save us from a lot of redundant development work?

    Thursday, November 17, 2011 at 11:35 pm #
  81. Andrew wrote::

    Hey Thibault,

    the biggest shock for me in this is the statement from Adobe about Flex that says html5 will be a better technology for enterprise application development.

    I just can’t really understand why Adobe would say something like this. I mean what does html5 know that previous versions of html don’t and that makes it suddenly a better solution for enterprise app dev? Sure, there are a couple of new tags regarding input and such, but I don’t see why that would help a lot. The browser fragmentation is still there, and while tooling can improve for html development, I don’t think it can reach the ease of development provided by Flex.

    I think if Flex would loose popularity because of this, it would be a lose-lose situation for everyone:
    -developers because of less robust, more painful workflows
    -users because apps wont work the same way on every browser, they wont have the same experience as before since that will take more effort and so will cost more for clients to afford, plus there’s browser incompatibility issues that will always be around when talking about html
    -clients because they will have to pay more
    -even Adobe will loose because instead of being the support behind the currently only viable solution for enterprise app development, it will be just one of the tool makers for html, and I’m pretty sure there will be good free tools as well

    Friday, November 18, 2011 at 2:38 pm #
  82. chris wrote::

    It just gets worse for flash on the web http://occupyflash.org/ , Flash player is simply a gaming and app platform, its a shame we don’t see any real defence to the hate for the desktop plugin. It seems App stores will replace flash on the web due to Adobe giving up.

    Saturday, November 19, 2011 at 2:41 pm #
  83. Jesus wrote::

    There is another version http://occupyhtml.org/

    Saturday, November 19, 2011 at 9:06 pm #
  84. Parizer wrote::

    Flash Player Mobile will be available on Android 4.0 (Ice Cream Sandwich)?
    http://bit.ly/vywJJU

    Sunday, November 20, 2011 at 12:37 am #
  85. devu wrote::

    @Thibault Imbert wrote::

    Hi Devu,

    I think at this point, you guys maybe do not believe us anymore. And with the recent PR mess, I can understand the hesitation.
    To be 100% sincere, I think we need to move away from the tell, and just show. This is the only way to change the perception.

    Hi @Thibault

    You might have heard about this that true and big love can very quickly turn in hate with the same intense.

    And I agree you shouldn’t talk anymore. Because all what has been told on latest MAX about Flash roadmap regarding to Flash AND mobile plugin version as well and Stage3D on it and Flex and lots of things turned to be a lie.

    Yes I have seen Adobe disclosure on the beginning of the official video from this event. Now I understand why was there. And making me even more angry if you have seen it coming before you opened our mouth.

    One of the reason of causing mobile Flash plugin development you saying is poor performance. So I have spent last 2 days to prove you another one lie.

    http://flaemo.com/blog/?page_id=2

    I am pretty sure you know how fast flash player is since you are who you are right?

    The only good thing could be good about your lies. You have said something about hard design decisions and limiting the API as well as speed for desktop Because you have to keep it consistent with mobile version. So if this is no longer the case can you speed up desktop now?

    Sunday, November 20, 2011 at 7:32 am #
  86. paha wrote::

    I think there’s quite bit of over rection and confusion present in many of the posts.

    The Flash Player plugin was supported well only on Android platform anyway, not on other key players (iOS, Windows). Although it works quite well with recent devices, the plugin is limited in some key features by being run through browser which means fe. multitouch support not working because browser overrides control over it.

    Focusing in AIR is definitely better for Flash based app development. I hope Adobe is committed to bring new features and performance improvements also in the future.

    Somehow I also think that these market providers don’t really want people running free web based apps and games on mobile platforms for obvious reasons ;)

    Sunday, November 20, 2011 at 9:56 pm #
  87. devu wrote::

    @paha

    Nope, full screen mode could make your flash based website look and feel like native app. I managed make kinetic list with 10k items working as smooth as native one for instance.

    Nobody disagree with having Focus on AIR improvements, that’s for sure.

    And I personally think your last paragraph is the main point of this story.

    Monday, November 21, 2011 at 5:17 pm #
  88. paha wrote::

    Yeah, but without features that are available only to native apps and AIR. Without proper touch or gyroscope support etc. it would not really be the same thing. So interactive apps would be compromised anyway.

    Monday, November 21, 2011 at 6:36 pm #
  89. tlecoz wrote::

    J’ai lu récemment dans un article que Flash CS6 intègrerai l’outil de google permettant de convertir une anim AS2 en html5.

    Si utiliser les outils des autres n’est pas un problème, pourquoi gaspiller vous votre temps, énergie et argent à coder FalconJS alors que Haxe & NME permettent de compiler en as3,js,android,c++,ios à partir du même code qui est très proche d’un code AS3 classique ?

    D’autant plus que les résultats sont excellent (3500 lapins qui sautent en même temps à 60 fps sur une tablette android).

    Wednesday, November 23, 2011 at 10:12 am #
  90. Tufik wrote::

    Adobe is killing to Flash, how AOL killed to Winamp, the best player but AOL failed to adapt to changes. Now Adobe is in the same position.

    I think that flash is a web without limitless. The correct alternative to the old and limited HTML, the old and limited JavaScript, and the end of fight of all Browsers for see a correct web.

    What going happen whit the OOP for the web, without Flas?
    What happen with the powerfull tool of video in the web (streaming, live, dynamic stream, etc)?
    What happen with the powerfull webs and apps, similars to audiotool.com, aviary.com, etc.

    The good of flash was the liberty that we had for do every thing and see the same result in all browsers, pcs, tvs, etc. Also the alternative to HTML and HTML5 “the same thing but with a copy/paste of some Flash features”. I think that the new HTML5 want to be Flash.
    In my opinion, i don’t like the decision. The real reaction of the people going to be, search and found new tools, for do the things that HTML5 can’t do.

    When i think in another tecnologies, example C# and Delphy, Delphy or Java don’t say “C# is the future and now we going to dead to Delphy” because, Delphy or Java are alternatives, and are faithful to their great community. I think that adobe have a gread community too and Adobe should think it. Flash isn’t a test technology, nor a temporary technology while another technologies implements caracteristics similars to Flash. And when this happens Flash going to go the recycle bin. Flash always showed the grand thirst for innovation and do grand things without think what the W3C were thinking about the good and bad for the web.

    Finally, Flash is a alternative technology, don’t a spare tire

    Monday, November 28, 2011 at 9:20 pm #
  91. judah wrote::

    Hi Thibault,

    I respect your opinion and work but I have a problem with your reasoning for this and your statement. You listen to the community for Flash, that much is true. But in this case I don’t remember getting a vote in this decision. This is the most important decision for Flash that could be made (whether to pull life support for mobile) and you did not ask us. I spent my life on working on Flash and seeing it succeed and in one minute you’ve crushed nearly all of it. If you are interested in the Flash community then listen to this.

    • We do not want you to determine if we will or will not use Flash on mobile devices. I have created and viewed mobile Flash sites and it works perfectly. Use a Blackberry Playbook for a few weeks instead of an iPad.

    It has been a bumpy start and *devices* have been under powered but they are capable now. Any 2011 or newer device runs Flash mobile as well as it’s desktop counter part. Don’t believe me I can send you a list of sites and devices.

    • Publishing to an app store just to get Flash content on a mobile device is a poor alternative. To start, it’s very difficult to get an app published. Besides the myriad of red tape and procedures to become a publisher it takes a exceeding amount of time to get an app approved. On average it’s 3 weeks+ to get an app on App World and 2 weeks on iTunes. Then it has to be approved and can be censored or removed if it conflicts with the companies interest. Then if you need to update it or fix a bug (security issue) you have to again go through the 2 week long approval process. With a mobile web app you can update it instantly and you can access it instantly (via URI). You can deploy once to the browser rather than 100 profiles.
    Tablets are desktops (portable desktops with built in touch support).

    • There are many Flex developers that depend on Flash and none of them were asked their opinion or if they were working on Flash mobile apps. How is that listening to the Flash community?

    There are companies and people that rely on Flash Player being in a browser (wherever that browser is being hosted). We need people like you to remember that.

    Friday, January 20, 2012 at 2:54 pm #
  92. Please support me on Adobe bug base (search for feature #3101789) here – https://bugbase.adobe.com/ for petition to continue support for Android Flash Player. My site (chatroulette.com) is getting a lot of clients from Android, and my site works almost perfectly and quite smoothly on android phones!

    Tuesday, January 31, 2012 at 9:02 pm #

Trackbacks/Pingbacks (9)

  1. Anonymous on Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 4:58 am

    [...] [...]

     
  2. Downsizing: Adobe Flash Style | Keyframer on Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 6:19 am

    [...] dead. There is a lot more to Flash than a mobile browser plugin for Android devices. Check out what Thibault Imbert (Flash Player Product Manager) and Lee Brimelow (Adobe Evangelist) have to say, they may ease your [...]

     
  3. Flash is Dead. Long live AIR! | unFocus Projects on Thursday, November 10, 2011 at 6:22 am

    [...] Preface: I wrote this one of the last few times the Flash is dead thing made the media rounds, because it seems as though many participants in the discussion are simply missing the bigger picture, that the market for rich interactive work is splitting between app store apps (native applications), and desktop browser-based apps (websites), and that those divisions are deep enough to require different development mindsets. The post is overly long – I don’t have an editor – but I figured I’d post it in its current draft state, since this keeps coming up, and so I don’t have to noodle with it anymore. So here it is. (Instant update: Lee Brimelow has said similar things in fewer words on his blog Update 2: Thibault Imbert chimes in.). [...]

     
  4. [...] Thibault Imbert blogged today saying we should all understand that dropping Flash from mobile is a good thing, and it allows Adobe to focus on AIR and Flash Player on the desktop. Apparently no-one was creating mobile browser Flash content anyway. I don’t disagree with this, but my issue is two-fold: First people are seeing this as Adobe killing off Flash. The “mobile” part of it is easily dropped in sensationalist headlines. This will only permeate the anti-Flash culture that Apple kick started. [...]

     
  5. [...] Thibault Imbert blogged today saying we should all understand that dropping Flash from mobile is a good thing, and it allows Adobe to focus on AIR and Flash Player on the desktop. Apparently no-one was creating mobile browser Flash content anyway. I don’t disagree with this, but my issue is two-fold: First people are seeing this as Adobe killing off Flash. The “mobile” part of it is easily dropped in sensationalist headlines. This will only permeate the anti-Flash culture that Apple kick started. [...]

     
  6. Good bye Flaemo | Flaemo on Sunday, November 13, 2011 at 2:37 am

    [...] Here is a little retrospection: “Stage3D will not be supported on mobile browsers because Stage3D is not part of the [...]

     
  7. Kurious.fr on Monday, November 14, 2011 at 6:02 pm

    [...] my point of view, and that#8217;s what Thibault Imbert says on his blog, Abode dropping Flash for the mobile browsers is a good thing but for a bit differents [...]

     
  8. [...] 他们也声明了Adobe认为Flash Player主要用于“高端游戏”和“高端视频”领域。 你可以以各种角度来理解它。一方面,这听起来好像是,所有即将给Flash添加的新功能都会提交给W3C和Webkit团队,这样,我们就能看到这些功能被添加到HTML5当中。另一反面这听起来又好像是,他们将会修改FLash IDE,使得它能够构建HTML5的项目,而不是导出成一个SWF文件。所以有可能我们会看到它制作的动画会到处成SVG和Sprit Sheet。 Thibault Imbert今天的博客说我们应该明白,放弃Flash对移动设备的支持是一件好事,这将使得Adobe更加专注于AIR和桌面版的Flash Palyer,显然没有人会使用Flash为移动浏览器上构建任何应用。我并不反对他的观点,但是我觉得问题是双重的:首先,人们会认为Adobe正在销毁Flash,“移动”一词很有可能被感官主义者从新闻头条中漏掉,这只会是反对Flash的火焰随着苹果公司的点燃而燃烧开来。尽管如此,我最大的问题是:是否有人为移动设备开发Flash游戏者并不重要,但是重要的是把移动设备上的Flash插件移除,这强制灌输一种思想,web是一个缺少Flash的领域。 智能手机市场确实非常巨大,并且目前手机游戏的数量要比掌机游戏多的多。很多人不会再玩你的Flash游戏,这回在客户群中产生碰撞效应。一些已经动摇的客户逐渐意思到,他们网站上的任何Flash元素(游戏,视频,交互)都无法在iOS上运行时,他们会更加害怕这些元素很快也无法在除了桌面以外的其他设备上运行。你可能不在意放弃支持iOS时带来的一点小损失,但是你绝对不能忽略那上百万的用户。 这对于我们来说可能不成问题,因为我们永远都不会为移动设备开发Flash游戏。 But you don’t upset the apple cart like this without bruising all aspects of the Flash world in the process.(这句没明白,大意是说会对动画界产生很大的影响)。 可能他发表的结论当中最打击人的是这部分: 长远来看,我们会继续为了Flash雄心勃勃的未来而努力工作,正如我们今天说过的,实现的细节可能有所改变。我们相信Flash的DNA并不是在这些实现的细节里,但是我们保证,我们会努力使得Flash能够更加简单的创造出最多的令人惊艳的用户体验。 [...]

     
  9. [...] Thibaud Imbert :  [...]